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left selvage thread breaking all the time
I’m trying to weave some overshot using 30/2 cotton as the warp and tabby weft. The problem is that the warp end on the left breaks every 6 or 7 picks. Doesn’t matter if I use a floating selvage or not. I’m using a temple and end delivery shuttles. I often have problems with the left most end breaking, but not every 6 or 7 picks. Any advice?
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15 Replies
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Hard to say as there could be several issues at play.
You say you are using a temple – is it set at the width of the warp at the reed?
Can you take a photo showing the cloth including the temple and beater?
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Here it is. Note that I’m now trying fishing line with my floating selvage on the left and am moving the temple after no more than half an inch of weaving. The temple is almost the perfect size with the warp ends remaining straight when I pull the beater forward. I was able to weave 1.5 inches with no breakage (all I’m doing is testing my threading). This has been a frustrating day!
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Oh indeed, very frustrating!
Did you do a ‘snap’ test on the warp yarn? If it is tender, it may just need a little extra ‘support’ beyond the temple.
Generally I ‘size’ the temple by comparing it to the warp at the reed. What you should be looking at is where the teeth are situated, not the end of the temple (if that’s what you are doing?)
If that doesn’t work, and the fishing line doesn’t seem to be a good choice in the end, my personal approach (which may not be suitable for others – it is whatever will do the job for the case in hand) is to double the outside warp ends in the heddle *but leave the density the same as in the rest of the warp in the reed*.
For example, I have been working with 2/16 cotton at either 32 or 36 epi. Usually it’s mostly ok, but if I’m weaving with linen, the weight of the bobbin can be too much for the strength of the cotton. Since it seems to work, I now just automatically set up 2/16 or 2/20 using this technique regardless of if I’m using linen or something else.
For 32 epi I use an 8 dent reed with 4 per dent; for 36 epi I use a 9 dent reed and use 4 per dent. So the doubled outside ends get put into the dent at the same density – 4 ends even though they are 2 per heddle.
I have no idea if that would work for you, of if you would be satisfied with the selvedges.
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The one time I tried weaving overshot with 20/2 for warp, the warp threads broke constantly, not just at the selvage but everywhere. My assumption at the time was that I’d gotten a bad batch of 20/2 that just didn’t have the tensile strength for the task at hand.
Which is to say: I second @laura-fry ‘s suggestion that you test the yarn to see if it’s simply too weak. If so, that’s small comfort since it doesn’t help you finish the project, but at least you can stop wondering if it’s something else like a heddle burr, a rust pit in the reed, something to do with the temple, etc.
Since you say it’s only happening on one side, you could also try Laura’s trick of moving your butt on the bench just slightly in the direction of the side that’s giving you trouble – maybe the resulting slight difference in draw-in could reduce abrasion enough to make some difference?
Good luck, and many glasses of the consolation beverage of your choice! ????
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Seconded. Especially with the new year (ahem) looming…
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Thanks all. Next time I weave something with fine threads (which is almost all the time), I’ll try the doubling through the heddle trick and see if that works. Meanwhile, I have about 11.5 meters of warp left to weave!
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One trick Janet has suggested in the past is to change the way the shuttle goes around the the floating selvedge. Sometimes if I I do over from the R side and under on the L side [and the over L side, under R side on the return] and am having problems, I change it it to over on the R side, over on the L side and under on the L side, under on the R side on the return. Basically instead of a figure eight, you are making a loop. Sometimes the figure eight may cause some abrasion on the warp thread or untwist it some, resulting in a break. Good luck in finding a solution that works for you.
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Oh, yes, of course! I forgot all about this.
It’s possible that the shuttle turning around the outside threads is adding or removing (ply) twist from those threads. Removing twist from a tender thread will certainly make it even more delicate. Adding twist shouldn’t hurt yarns meant for weaving.
(Adding twist is a problem if the yarn already has as much twist as it can take, but yarn that twisty is really the domain of brand new spinners – ASK ME HOW I KNOW. I don’t think overtwisted yarns for weaving are ever that twisted.)
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As a spinner who puts way too much twist in her yarn, I know all about too much twist! I once figured out that I’m going over and under my selvage threads such that twist is being added to the left side, which is where I have problems. I did reverse it on my last project (8/2 cotton), but it made no difference.
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It’ll depend on whether the yarn was plied with an S or Z twist (or spun S or Z if it isn’t plied).
Fun fact: although most commercial yarns are plied one way (Z, I think??) M Brassard 8/4, 8/8 are the opposite, because they’re actually cables: 8/4 is four strands of 16/2 plied together, and 8/8 is four strands of 8/2 plied together. The second plying goes in the opposite direction.
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I use Janet’s trick and it certainly helps on the right selvage–I haven’t had it break since I started using it. And I’ve tried reversing the way I do it on previous projects with no luck. I think the left side of my loom just has it out for me ????
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Have you tried bribing it? What would make a good bribe for a loom, anyway?
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I have tried threatening the loom. Maybe a bribe would work better…
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is it breaking due to abrasion, or is it unplying?
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Really can’t tell–it just breaks! Adding fishing line to the left selvage is helping.
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