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Crying over a warp.
It’s said that an Echo and Jin warp is the warp that keeps on giving. OMG this one has. Thank God I only used 2 color warp. But its also a parleele threading. I think you can see one better than the in both pics .I have two groups of threads all twisted up. After rethreading three times and weaving was going so well I was going to try my hand a double weave as part of this project. I had my colors picked and was getting ready to crawl around on the floor for the next half hour so I could spend the rest of my day weaving. Kathy’s blog this afternoon that Tien just posted let me know I am not alone in this mess but I really feel so out of sorts over this entire thing. I posted a picture in a forum once last year when Janet asked what do you want to learn. The picture I believe was one of a lovely shawl made by a woman Janet at least knew of. I want to learn how to do this beautiful work. With colors and shine, and makes people say awe or wow. But all I manage are tears. Since I have about 18 inches of color testing its not a big deal to cut it off and start again, I will have to go thread by thread until I get to the messed up part and then take it all out to get the threads back in line. OMG this warp can stop giving any time because if it happens again, I will take the shears. Our weather forecast says we are to get 8 to 17 inches of snow between now and Sunday afternoon, I was going to put off groceries until Sunday but I think I better go today. while its cold and sunny vs 8 inches of heavy wet snow.
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16 Replies
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So disappointing when things like this happen. :( Is the ‘tangle’ causing issues in the weaving? Or can it be kept close enough to the back beam to allow an ok shed?
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It’s right behind the heddles it seems to be moving forward with the warp. There is no choice but to cut it off and start again or take the shears to it and forget it. But its not just string, its hours of planning and coloring, picking colors to match, and on and on, so there is only one choice I know I am not the only one but I am really having a pitty party for me today. So besides not feeling well I get to do this too. I had some retail therapy this afternoon, although it was not yarn I bought but food, it was nice to shop and be at home, instead of where I work I get to see lots of people I don’t normally see, so that was nice. And I can eat for a week or two. Thanks Laura, your the best.
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Before you cut off, can you create an area that is plain weave or close to it? If you put lease sticks in the back you can use them to “comb out” the tangles before they hit the heddles. You’ll have to work the lease sticks back (dealing with the tangles as you go) when they start getting closer to the heddles, but it would be a lot easier than rethreading everything again.
You don’t need a true plain weave, just something that alternates threads frequently enough that it can be used to comb out tangles.
I leave my lease sticks in when weaving, at least until I’m confident that all is working and that I don’t need them. Especially when weaving with fine threads that might break; it makes it a lot easier to find the broken threads and fix them.
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If the warp is too twisted up to be able to get a stick into plain weave sheds and them move them back, you could raise just one shaft, put the stick under just its threads, and work it to the back beam. That will effectively “comb” out the threads on just one shaft. Then do the next shaft, and the next, and the next.
When dressing the loom with what are effectively two densely sett colorways – say for double weave or double faced cloth – I often wind the two colorways as separate warps, put each one on its own apron rod, and beam them together. (No need to keep the colorways separate as they wind on, so just the one usual layer of packing.) That keeps the two sets of threads from twisting with each other at least.
You’ll wind up with two sets of lease sticks to thread from, but that isn’t really a problem, in my experience.
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Thank you Janet, I am going to take it out and fix the twist it’s to massive not to. The warp is two painted warps beamed as one, for a parallel threading. That part went fine. Beaming was the least of my issues. When going over my threading I found a mistake in the middle took it out and did it again, #2 threading I was short 8 threads. What happened to those 8 threads, well I found them again in the middle of the threading and had woven some and had long floats so I had to fix them. On to threading #3, I found my 8 threads in the middle (same place.) I rethreaded fixed a couple of broken threads and wove 18 inches, or so. Since this is an Echo and Jin threading, it also only needed to change the tie-up for double weave which I have been wanting to do. That is when I found a real mess. If it was only like 4 or 5 threads, but it’s about 20 to 30 threads in one spot and 10-20 in the other spot. I knew I had some twisting going on, but not like this. I have taken some time to think about it, worked on the strips class last night instead of weaving, and just chilled. We are having bad weather and I don’t need to go anywhere so I am reading, and will tackle it later today. But first I have some questions for Carly Jane, too, and I so appreciate the help I get here in the Academy Tien even looked up a light for me like one she has. Yeah, lights. A photographer’s light will work for pictures too. I may try moving the threads back on the smaller mess. But if I take it out, well i may as well do it right. Its samples anyway, I just want enough for a scarf in the end, I still have enough yardage. I left 36 inches for sampling and loom waste, and this loom has less waste than the old loom. Thank you.
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Awesome idea, but I warp front to back, and would have to move my lease sticks to the back of the loom after I have tied on. I take them out and put in angel wings in the back once I start to beam, so far this has worked well for me. Laura Fry’s method of warping looks great too, I am just to chicken to change anything to try it. She has her valet on the ceiling and then weights hanging from her warp. Its so much of a change but I may have to try one day.
Janet has some sort of the same idea. I told her I planned 36 inches for samples and loom waste, and I did not have this loom when I did that and it has much less waste than my HD loom. So far I may have used 24 inches of my waste. So I think it will be just as easy to cut it as its involves about 20-30 threads, all mashed together. Thank you .
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While it may look daunting (and I do understand the disappointment!) fixing it seems to be the best approach.
On my current warp I wove about 9″ before I discovered a threading error. I had threaded 10-7 twice instead of 7-10. Fortunately it was just a sequence issue and fairly easily fixed, but I did have to cut off and toss the first bit of weaving.
What I did was cut those 8 ends off before I cut the header off so that all the other threads in the warp were secure. Once the mistake was fixed, including re-sleying, did I cut the ‘header’ off and then re-tie the warp.
Don’t know if that will work for you, though…
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Laura your the best. I just sat down and cut off my warp 5 min before I saw this. However. I am only unsleying the part that is bad and have already secured the good stuff, just not as smartly as you. I am going to have to rethread those sections, but as soon as I figure out the sequence I will be back in business. LOL disappointing yes. Good comes from all our mistakes, I could not see that yesterday thou. I am going to wind a little warp for my RH today and make some plain weave towels tonight instead of surf the net looking for the next project. So my pen and paper are ready to find that threading sequence after I post a couple pictures for Tien. Maybe I will queue up one of my favorite Laura Fry books and listen for a bit. Do you know when I looked you up the first time on Google, it was not you I found first. There was a famous equestrian named Laura Fry who was an Olympic champion in jumping or dressage, her daughter is now taking her place in the horse world. I am not in that horse world but friends are. I take more to rodeo, training, and working stock horses and barrel racing, over jumping. So I never knew anything about this woman, and right now I can not tell you if she was a US team member or British. The things we learn from Google
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I believe she was American, although I’m not sure. There was also a younger person with the same name, but she was a spinner. :) Anyway, lots of us around.
Good for you getting yourself organized to fix the problem. It is disappointing when they happen, but they do. I wasn’t best pleased I made the mistake I did! But it could have been a lot worse. I’m now 1/3 the way through the warp. Just wove some ‘samples’ for an article I’m writing on selvedges. It’s hard to describe a problem; so much easier if I can include a photo of the issue.
Right now I’m fighting the urge to just sit and read my library book. Guess I’d better go deal with stripping the first bit off the cloth beam and re-tying. I’d like to weave once more today, too. :)
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Well, I found the spot in my threading chart and then tore up fabric strips for rag rugs my next project. We have a woolen mill that makes wool jackets and vests. Used to make and sell wool plaid pants, jackets, vests, hats, rugs, and lots of things, the woman who inherited it from her family has run it for many years and sold out a couple of yrs ago. They had a shipping container full of bags of scrap material and I picked up 3 bags of wool and 2 bags of flannel. I think I have enough in one bag (approx 60lbs) to make 2 maybe 3 rugs. only keeping the easy-to-work-with stuff.
Iol Laura, I did not see your mistake. lol maybe I did not look hard enough.
Everything I have seen you have done is lovely.
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If it makes you feel any better, I once rethreaded a warp not twice, not three times, but FOUR times. It was something like 900 ends, and the threading repeat was 300+ ends.
I said a LOT of VERY bad words.
But it got done, and I never had to look at it again, so I call it a win.
Plus, I now use that as a benchmark of “worst warp ever”, so maybe now you have your very own worst warp, and they will all be better than this one!
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I just finished #4 time of doing that warp. Almost all back in the reed and in the morning and back in business, I am not doing again. Any mistakes can stay there.
I had questions dang. I did order me an iPad I hope it’s worth my trouble to help me keep track. If it does not have the voice command it will all be for not. My pin in the paper will have to work. forgot my other question.
Hubby came home late so I was cooking dinner at 7pm
You are the best, Kathy. Laura Fry had a threading error this week. I could not see it but she could.
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WHICH WORDS DID YOU SAY, KATHY? Inquiring minds want to know! (though… maybe not here in the forums. :P)
I love the idea of a “worst warp” benchmark, though I hope it’s a long time before I find myself re-setting that bar.
I don’t think I’ve ever had to rethread a warp four times, but on one memorable occasion I forgot to thread my warp AT ALL. It was really super short and I was putting it on my biggest loom which did not like short warps, so was totally focused on lashing on to save length. I was just about to put in some header when I realized that the raddle was still in the beater. “That’s odd,” thought I. “Why didn’t I take the raddle out before I threaded?”
…and then the penny dropped.
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Janet,
I have given up on this project and all its samples. One day over tea or coffee, or Facetime I will tell you the story but not in public. No bad words, I kept my cool. I was a good girl. Unlike Kathy.LOL.
@laura-fry I did not tell you this either yet. @janet I decided the colors in this warp were too pretty to toss and too nice not to enjoy weaving them. I had dyed a yarn to try as weft, I got carried away with the dye, and it came out almost black, it’s called Kilt green, and it has a wonderful iridescent shine to it. I picked a treadling, not at all complicated, and will finish the scarf with this weft color and design, the colors do not show the design as well as I would have liked, but I decided to enjoy the colors.
The fact my salvages are coming out great sends me over the top. I did something I was told was impossible to do, that being, warping 2 warps as one working front to back. And I can do it again, and will. I am very happy with myself I learned how to warp font to back, by myself, with the help of a (local sorta) weaver, it’s taken a long time but with the tools I have Dena’s help, and I got it down. I still have to try Laura’s way too.
So I am going to enjoy this warp, not fight with it. I have been ripping up fabric strips to some rugs I ordered rug warp this evening.
I also found a woman who does historical weaving, she has a variation of overshot I have to try its so pretty working on this draft I have tons of material to build my draft with. As soon as the rugs are done, then it will be time for a scarf from one of Marian Stubenistsky’s books. I have the draft all done on my computer and ordered the yarn this evening. Ahh, and I am finally feeling better still have rice cripes in my ears, but feeling great. I have learned a valuable lesson from this warp from hell, it is not impossible to warp an Echo warp front to back, the Academy is my happy space, (as well as the barn with the rabbits), and some instructors are not instructors and the weaving community as a whole is a wonderful bunch of crazy cat ladies, (no cats here) Happy Easter and Happy Weaving ladies your the best.
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It’s a matter of training your eye. It was very obvious to me, even though it wasn’t particularly obvious to others. But I couldn’t bear the thought of weaving 20 yards with that mistake staring me in the eye! :D There have been times when I’ve gotten half way through a warp without seeing a threading mistake, and when that happens, I usually just keep going…
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lol One of the reasons I have taken this warp apart so many times. I found mistakes and could not bare to leave them. I whine, a lot, and fuss, but I am ready to weave. Your mistake was not obvious to me at all a bobble here, or there I would not notice, but a skipped dent, makes a funky spot. knots, this warp has a few in twills they show, and in overshot I can notice. I want it right. It’s why I work so hard. This evening, I have an entirely different problem. I do not know how to do what I need to.
I have a draft with treading and a tie-up as well as the lift plan. I can change a lift plan to a tie-up, by hand or on the computer. My WIF is 8S, 8 T . and there are 6 different ways to treadle this piece. I have done a couple and want to do the double weave. I have sent an email to the instructor, Denise Kovant, a wonderful lady. The tie-up for the double weave is with 16 treadles but so it the treadling. lol I used Tims’s Treadle reducer to get my 10-treadles tie-up LOL NOW WHAT? Echo and Jin the warp that keeps on giving. I am going to play around for a few minutes to see if I can figure it out. Otherwise, go for a different tie-up and wait for Denise I am really looking forward to making some rugs plain weave or an easy twill and I will chill. lol. Laura really, if something did not happen in anything I do I would feel the world forgot about me. As it is so many things happen I never run out of stories. My cake decorating stories and baking stories are very funny. My son’s wedding cake, Long story short- I took the cake to the hall the night before and set it on the table, I was beautiful. I took it in put it together and took some pictures and left. Before dinner, I had to re-decorate one entire side because the sun from the window bleached out my lavender decorations to gray. I did have enough frosting but I had a lot to do in a very short time. But at least I did not have a sick kid from that cake. lol Another one for another day.
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